SCOTT SIMON, HOST:

“The World” tells the story of the human household by means of households the Caesars and Borgias, Kims and Tudors, Roosevelts, Hapsburgs, Saud and households which can be comparable in type – Plato and Confucius, Gandhi and Kenyatta, Empress Wu and King Alara, a thousand pages of plagues, pandemics and crimes in opposition to humanity, together with staggering survival and achievements. And you may learn the entire e book whereas listening to a playlist.

(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, “SYMPATHY FOR THE DEVIL”)

ROLLING STONES: (Singing) Please enable me to introduce myself. I am a person of wealth and style.

SIMON: Greater than 400 songs from the Rolling Stones, Bob Marley, Bob Dylan, Aretha Franklin, The Commodores and plenty of extra. The eminent historian Simon Sebag Montefiore joins us. I collect you consider “Sympathy For The Satan” is the most effective track about historical past.

SIMON SEBAG MONTEFIORE: I put it as my No. 1 – the sensible method it is written, the trope of an unknown narrator that we whom we uncover, whose id is revealed and who performs a task in lots of the most horrible atrocities of the twentieth century. I believe it is one of many best-written rock songs of all time.

(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, “SYMPATHY FOR THE DEVIL”)

ROLLING STONES: (Singing) I rode a tank, held a common’s rank when the Blitzkrieg raged and the our bodies stank.

SIMON: What is that this playlist present for our perspective on historical past?

MONTEFIORE: Properly, a part of the enjoyable factor about writing a household historical past is to get a really feel of the best way individuals lived, which isn’t simply empires rising and falling, battles and pandemics, but in addition how they ate, how they dressed and, after all, what sort of music they hearken to. And so I believed, God, it might be actually enjoyable to have a playlist of all the good historical past songs, which I outline as – historical past track is both a couple of historic character or characters, or it is a track that turns into the theme of a historic occasion.

(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, “STRANGE FRUIT”)

NINA SIMONE: (Singing) Southern timber…

SIMON: Extra music – Nina Simone’s model of “Unusual Fruit.”

SIMONE: (Singing) …Bearing unusual fruit – blood on the leaves and blood on the roots. Black our bodies swinging within the Southern breeze.

SIMON: What can we hear on this track?

MONTEFIORE: I imply, this can be a track this can be a terrifying, horrible, atrocious narrative of a lynching within the South. It tells a part of the story of America, of the Jim Crow years of America. And slavery is an enormous a part of this world historical past, Atlantic slavery, but in addition different slave trades in East Africa, trans-Saharan and the Mediterranean-Black Sea slave commerce as effectively. , the beauty of writing a household historical past of the world is that you would be able to cowl this stuff in particular methods. So among the households, as you talked about, are royal households, political households, households of energy, however some are enslaved households, too.

(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, “STRANGE FRUIT”)

SIMONE: (Singing) Then the sudden odor of burning flesh.

SIMON: I really feel the necessity to cite the writer of the track Abel Meeropol. Have you learnt that story?

MONTEFIORE: Yeah. I imply, he is a – he was Jewish.

SIMON: Abel Meeropol adopted Michael and Robby (ph) Meeropol, who had been born to Julius and Ethel Rosenberg.

MONTEFIORE: Wonderful. Wonderful.

(SOUNDBITE OF HERMAN’S HERMITS SONG, “I’M HENRY VIII, I AM”)

SIMON: In one other route completely…

(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, “I’M HENRY VIII, I AM”)

HERMAN’S HERMITS: (Singing) I am Henry VIII, I’m. Henry VIII I’m, I’m. I bought married to the widow subsequent door. She’s been married seven occasions earlier than.

SIMON: …What scholarly contribution does or do Herman’s Hermits make?

MONTEFIORE: A few of these songs are extraordinarily darkish and nearly insufferable, , like “Unusual Fruit,” and a few are simply outrageous enjoyable. I imply, you have to be prepared for all kinds of adjustments of tone.

(SOUNDBITE OF HERMAN’S HERMITS SONG, “I’M HENRY VIII, I AM”)

MONTEFIORE: , one of many issues that is enjoyable about this isn’t simply to have songs that point out historic characters. I imply, certainly one of my favorites is The Stranglers’ “No Extra Heroes.”

(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, “NO MORE HEROES”)

THE STRANGLERS: (Singing) No matter occurred to Leon Trotsky? He bought an ice choose that made his ears burn.

MONTEFIORE: That is one other great one, too. And there is songs about severe issues, , “Baraye,” the gorgeous track, Iranian track, from immediately.

(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, “BARAYE”)

SHERVIN HAJIPOUR: (Singing in non-English language).

MONTEFIORE: There are songs from Ukraine, for instance.

(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, “STEFANIA”)

KALUSH AND KALUSH ORCHESTRA: (Singing in non-English language).

MONTEFIORE: There are songs from the Soviet Union in World Conflict II.

(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, “KATIOUCHA”)

ALEXANDROV ENSEMBLE: (Singing in non-English language).

MONTEFIORE: So I hope that one finds as a lot selection right here as one does within the e book as one does in world historical past.

(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, “ODE TO BILLIE JOE”)

BOBBIE GENTRY: (Singing) It was the three of June, one other sleepy, dusty Delta day.

SIMON: From following your e book tour, I perceive simply this week you had been on the Tallahatchie Bridge.

MONTEFIORE: Is it the Tallahatchie Bridge. Bobbie Gentry is within the checklist, after all. After all I finished the automobile and simply had a second.

(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, “ODE TO BILLIE JOE”)

GENTRY: (Singing) And Mama hollered on the again door, y’all keep in mind to wipe your ft. After which she stated, I bought some information this morning from Choctaw Ridge. At this time, Billy Joe McAllister jumped off the Tallahatchie Bridge.

MONTEFIORE: And I used to be simply in Graceland, too. And I believe Elvis is a kind of characters. For about 50 years, the good pop stars had been like – and I am barely exaggerating right here however not utterly, I believe – had been just like the grand dukes, the cardinals, perhaps the good artists of bygone eras. A few of them are important for a world historical past. So we have got Frank Sinatra. We have Bowie. We have Elvis, after all. And the Stones and the Beatles are all actually a part of the event of commerce, of capitalism, of a single American tradition, of American domination of world tradition. Frank Sinatra is a traditional instance. He sung on the 1946 summit assembly of the Mafia, who’re within the e book – Fortunate Luciano and Bugsy Siegel and Meyer Lansky. He was associates with Jack Kennedy. He launched Kennedy to Marilyn Monroe and Judith Exner.

SIMON: And Marilyn Monroe’s model of “Joyful Birthday, Mr. President” can also be on the playlist.

(SOUNDBITE OF ARCHIVED RECORDING)

MARILYN MONROE: (Singing) Joyful birthday to you.

HAJIPOUR: Completely. I imply, she’s within the e book. Her singing that track is the form of climax of Camelot in some ways. And the Kennedys are an enormous a part of this story. And in case one thinks dynasties are over, in many of the remainder of the world, for all kinds of causes, persons are returning to dynasties, to clans, to households of various kinds.

SIMON: There is a Marcos again in energy within the Philippines.

MONTEFIORE: There is a Marcos again in energy. There was a Kenyatta again in energy. After which there are correct monarchies, that are driving excessive. Have a look at the Saudi monarchy, for instance. After which there are republic monarchies, just like the Kims of North Korea, the Assads and plenty of, many others who’re attempting to create precise hereditary dynasties like monarchies. Individuals typically ask me, who’s probably the most highly effective household on the earth? And, after all, the reply needs to be the Kim household of North Korea as a result of they’ve the last word heirloom, a nuclear arsenal.

SIMON: You write in “The World,” historical past reveals that people have a limitless potential to destroy and an ingenious potential to get better. So the final track I need to ask you about is, after all, by a Chicagoan, Sam Cooke. (Singing) Do not know a lot about historical past.

(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, “WONDERFUL WORLD”)

SAM COOKE: (Singing) Do not know a lot about historical past. Do not know a lot biology.

SIMON: What knowledge from historical past or about historical past is on this track?

MONTEFIORE: The explanation why I’ve it within the playlist isn’t just that it mentions historical past. And it’s the most lovely track. It is also optimistic about human nature.

(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, “WONDERFUL WORLD”)

COOKE: (Singing) And I do know that should you love me, too, what a beautiful world this is able to be.

MONTEFIORE: And there is one thing else. I do not know a lot about historical past. Chances are you’ll discover this shocking for somebody who’s simply written…

SIMON: A thousand pages. Sure, proper.

MONTEFIORE: We frequently revere historical past as propulsive, as nearly sacred in its authority. And, in truth, historical past would not matter that a lot. What actually issues is how individuals need to stay now. And that is the distinction between Ukraine, for instance, and President Putin. President Putin resides within the age of Catherine the Nice and Prince Potemkin and Nicholas I. And the Ukrainians need to stay now in freedom. And that is the theme of that lovely track by Sam Cooke.

MONTEFIORE: Simon Sebag Montefiore – his new e book, “The World: A Household Historical past Of Humanity,” accompanied by a playlist on Spotify. Thanks a lot for being with us.

SIMON: At all times beautiful to speak to you.

(SOUNDBITE OF SONG, “WONDERFUL WORLD”)

COOKE: (Singing) Do not know a lot about algebra. Do not know what a slide rule is for. However I do know one and one is 2. And if this one may very well be with you, what a beautiful world this is able to be. Now, I do not declare…

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